From warmerdam at pobox.com Fri Sep 7 10:47:27 2007 From: warmerdam at pobox.com (Frank Warmerdam) Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 10:47:27 -0400 Subject: [tiling] OGC Tiled WMS Discussion Paper Message-ID: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> Folks, I was contacted by Edric Keighan about a discussion paper that was recently submitted to OGC (with Cubewerx as the editor) titled: 07-057r2 OpenGIS Tiled WMS Discussion Paper I believe it is roughly comparible in goals to this work: http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching I believe Edric is interested in feedback on the paper and support for the proposal (for those of us who are OGC members) and perhaps more importantly he is interested in implementations of the specification within our projects with OpenLayers being the most obvious candidate. I believe he has also contacted Cameron Shorter who is an OGC member and who is directly involved with OpenLayers. I'm hoping that Cameron will review the paper and perhaps compare and contrast with the WMS Tile Caching spec at: http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching I haven't been to involved in the tiling spec in the past, so I'm going to mostly back out of this discussion now, but I wanted to ensure everyone is aware of what is going on, and that we open up some discussion. Anyone wanting to contact Edric can do so at the email in the cc:. Best regards, -- ---------------------------------------+-------------------------------------- I set the clouds in motion - turn up | Frank Warmerdam, warmerdam at pobox.com light and sound - activate the windows | http://pobox.com/~warmerdam and watch the world go round - Rush | President OSGeo, http://osgeo.org From pramsey at refractions.net Fri Sep 7 12:29:40 2007 From: pramsey at refractions.net (Paul Ramsey) Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 09:29:40 -0700 Subject: [tiling] OGC Tiled WMS Discussion Paper In-Reply-To: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> References: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> Message-ID: <46E17C74.6040804@refractions.net> Where would we get a copy to comment? I don't see it here http://www.opengeospatial.org/standards/dp P. Frank Warmerdam wrote: > Folks, > > I was contacted by Edric Keighan about a discussion paper that was > recently submitted to OGC (with Cubewerx as the editor) titled: > > 07-057r2 OpenGIS Tiled WMS Discussion Paper > > I believe it is roughly comparible in goals to this work: > > http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching > > I believe Edric is interested in feedback on the paper and support for the > proposal (for those of us who are OGC members) and perhaps more importantly > he is interested in implementations of the specification within our projects > with OpenLayers being the most obvious candidate. > > I believe he has also contacted Cameron Shorter who is an OGC member and > who is directly involved with OpenLayers. I'm hoping that Cameron will > review the paper and perhaps compare and contrast with the WMS Tile Caching > spec at: > > http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching > > I haven't been to involved in the tiling spec in the past, so I'm going to > mostly back out of this discussion now, but I wanted to ensure everyone is > aware of what is going on, and that we open up some discussion. > > Anyone wanting to contact Edric can do so at the email in the cc:. > > Best regards, -- Paul Ramsey Refractions Research http://www.refractions.net pramsey at refractions.net Phone: 250-383-3022 Cell: 250-885-0632 From sophia.parafina at ionicenterprise.com Fri Sep 7 13:11:31 2007 From: sophia.parafina at ionicenterprise.com (Sophia Parafina) Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 13:11:31 -0400 Subject: [tiling] OGC Tiled WMS Discussion Paper In-Reply-To: <46E17C74.6040804@refractions.net> References: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> <46E17C74.6040804@refractions.net> Message-ID: <46E18643.2070606@ionicenterprise.com> It's still in the members area in the List of Pending Documents. I forget the policy, but you can probably request a copy. sophia Paul Ramsey wrote: > Where would we get a copy to comment? I don't see it here > http://www.opengeospatial.org/standards/dp > > P. > > Frank Warmerdam wrote: > >> Folks, >> >> I was contacted by Edric Keighan about a discussion paper that was >> recently submitted to OGC (with Cubewerx as the editor) titled: >> >> 07-057r2 OpenGIS Tiled WMS Discussion Paper >> >> I believe it is roughly comparible in goals to this work: >> >> http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching >> >> I believe Edric is interested in feedback on the paper and support for the >> proposal (for those of us who are OGC members) and perhaps more importantly >> he is interested in implementations of the specification within our projects >> with OpenLayers being the most obvious candidate. >> >> I believe he has also contacted Cameron Shorter who is an OGC member and >> who is directly involved with OpenLayers. I'm hoping that Cameron will >> review the paper and perhaps compare and contrast with the WMS Tile Caching >> spec at: >> >> http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching >> >> I haven't been to involved in the tiling spec in the past, so I'm going to >> mostly back out of this discussion now, but I wanted to ensure everyone is >> aware of what is going on, and that we open up some discussion. >> >> Anyone wanting to contact Edric can do so at the email in the cc:. >> >> Best regards, >> > > > From sgillies at frii.com Fri Sep 7 14:37:13 2007 From: sgillies at frii.com (Sean Gillies) Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 12:37:13 -0600 Subject: [tiling] OGC Tiled WMS Discussion Paper In-Reply-To: <46E18643.2070606@ionicenterprise.com> References: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> <46E17C74.6040804@refractions.net> <46E18643.2070606@ionicenterprise.com> Message-ID: <46E19A59.10700@frii.com> Much more fun to speculate about what's in it. Square tiles, or hexagonal? Sean Sophia Parafina wrote: > It's still in the members area in the List of Pending Documents. I > forget the policy, but you can probably request a copy. > > sophia > > Paul Ramsey wrote: >> Where would we get a copy to comment? I don't see it here >> http://www.opengeospatial.org/standards/dp >> >> P. >> >> Frank Warmerdam wrote: >> >>> Folks, >>> >>> I was contacted by Edric Keighan about a discussion paper that was >>> recently submitted to OGC (with Cubewerx as the editor) titled: >>> >>> 07-057r2 OpenGIS Tiled WMS Discussion Paper >>> >>> I believe it is roughly comparible in goals to this work: >>> >>> http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching >>> >>> I believe Edric is interested in feedback on the paper and support for the >>> proposal (for those of us who are OGC members) and perhaps more importantly >>> he is interested in implementations of the specification within our projects >>> with OpenLayers being the most obvious candidate. >>> >>> I believe he has also contacted Cameron Shorter who is an OGC member and >>> who is directly involved with OpenLayers. I'm hoping that Cameron will >>> review the paper and perhaps compare and contrast with the WMS Tile Caching >>> spec at: >>> >>> http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching >>> >>> I haven't been to involved in the tiling spec in the past, so I'm going to >>> mostly back out of this discussion now, but I wanted to ensure everyone is >>> aware of what is going on, and that we open up some discussion. >>> >>> Anyone wanting to contact Edric can do so at the email in the cc:. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > tiling mailing list > tiling at lists.eogeo.org > http://lists.eogeo.org/mailman/listinfo/tiling > From crschmidt at crschmidt.net Fri Sep 7 15:00:28 2007 From: crschmidt at crschmidt.net (Christopher Schmidt) Date: Fri, 7 Sep 2007 15:00:28 -0400 Subject: [tiling] OGC Tiled WMS Discussion Paper In-Reply-To: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> References: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> Message-ID: <20070907190028.GB8378@crschmidt.net> On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 10:47:27AM -0400, Frank Warmerdam wrote: > Folks, > > I was contacted by Edric Keighan about a discussion paper that was > recently submitted to OGC (with Cubewerx as the editor) titled: > > 07-057r2 OpenGIS Tiled WMS Discussion Paper I'm guessing this would be a continuation of OGC 07-057? The editors of that were not Cubewerx, but from uab.cat, if my records serve. I'd be interested in seeing either of the two documents, and would ask that > I believe it is roughly comparible in goals to this work: > > http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching > > I believe Edric is interested in feedback on the paper and support for the > proposal (for those of us who are OGC members) and perhaps more importantly > he is interested in implementations of the specification within our projects > with OpenLayers being the most obvious candidate. OpenLayers is unlikely to add support for further tiled WMS specifications through the work of its current set of developers. Additional layers would need to be created, tested, and supported by some other person who would accept 'ownership' of the layer type: I've already avoided including some functionality in OpenLayers simply because no one was willing to take on the task of supporting it. If some person or organization is willing to take on the task of supporting a layer, then in general, OpenLayers is open to the task of adding that functionality. However, I'm somewhat hesitant to include yet-another way of accessing pre-cached WMS information: especially if it has not taken into account the design goals of the Recommendation we created at the last FOSS4G, which is described at: http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tiling_Client_Recommendation An example of things we explicitly discussed and discarded: * GetTile requests -- we wanted to stick with GetMap, and simply allow for matching the map request to a tile when appropriate. * Using anything other than the standard GetCapabilities for describing functionality: GetCapabilities allows for vendor extensions, and this seemed the right way to pass the information back to the client * Starting the tiles at the '0,0' point of the world (Instead choosing to go for the lower left corner). Note that this is different from Google's tiles, but the same as WorldWind's. * Creating any new form of requests -- it's easiest for client functionality to simply extend the existing requests rather than creating new formats. Again, I don't know what's in the document: if someone could tell me more specifically how to get a copy of it, I could offer a more formal review from the point of view of an implementor of a tile map server. Thanks for the heads up, Frank. Regards, -- Christopher Schmidt Web Developer From sophia.parafina at ionicenterprise.com Fri Sep 7 15:25:59 2007 From: sophia.parafina at ionicenterprise.com (Sophia Parafina) Date: Fri, 07 Sep 2007 15:25:59 -0400 Subject: [tiling] OGC Tiled WMS Discussion Paper In-Reply-To: <20070907190028.GB8378@crschmidt.net> References: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> <20070907190028.GB8378@crschmidt.net> Message-ID: <46E1A5C7.8040007@ionicenterprise.com> I've asked Carl Reed at OGC to make it available for comment. sophia Christopher Schmidt wrote: > On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 10:47:27AM -0400, Frank Warmerdam wrote: > >> Folks, >> >> I was contacted by Edric Keighan about a discussion paper that was >> recently submitted to OGC (with Cubewerx as the editor) titled: >> >> 07-057r2 OpenGIS Tiled WMS Discussion Paper >> > > I'm guessing this would be a continuation of OGC 07-057? The editors of > that were not Cubewerx, but from uab.cat, if my records serve. I'd be > interested in seeing either of the two documents, and would ask that > > >> I believe it is roughly comparible in goals to this work: >> >> http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching >> >> I believe Edric is interested in feedback on the paper and support for the >> proposal (for those of us who are OGC members) and perhaps more importantly >> he is interested in implementations of the specification within our projects >> with OpenLayers being the most obvious candidate. >> > > OpenLayers is unlikely to add support for further tiled WMS > specifications through the work of its current set of developers. > Additional layers would need to be created, tested, and supported by > some other person who would accept 'ownership' of the layer type: I've > already avoided including some functionality in OpenLayers simply > because no one was willing to take on the task of supporting it. > > If some person or organization is willing to take on the task of > supporting a layer, then in general, OpenLayers is open to the task of > adding that functionality. However, I'm somewhat hesitant to include > yet-another way of accessing pre-cached WMS information: especially if > it has not taken into account the design goals of the Recommendation we > created at the last FOSS4G, which is described at: > > http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tiling_Client_Recommendation > > An example of things we explicitly discussed and discarded: > * GetTile requests -- we wanted to stick with GetMap, and simply allow > for matching the map request to a tile when appropriate. > * Using anything other than the standard GetCapabilities for describing > functionality: GetCapabilities allows for vendor extensions, and this > seemed the right way to pass the information back to the client > * Starting the tiles at the '0,0' point of the world (Instead choosing > to go for the lower left corner). Note that this is different from > Google's tiles, but the same as WorldWind's. > * Creating any new form of requests -- it's easiest for client > functionality to simply extend the existing requests rather than > creating new formats. > > Again, I don't know what's in the document: if someone could tell me > more specifically how to get a copy of it, I could offer a more formal > review from the point of view of an implementor of a tile map server. > > Thanks for the heads up, Frank. > > Regards, > From sophia.parafina at ionicenterprise.com Thu Sep 13 12:57:16 2007 From: sophia.parafina at ionicenterprise.com (Sophia Parafina) Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2007 12:57:16 -0400 Subject: [tiling] OGC Tiled WMS Discussion Paper In-Reply-To: <46E1AAE7.2010000@cubewerx.com> References: <46E1647F.5030003@pobox.com> <20070907190028.GB8378@crschmidt.net> <46E1A5C7.8040007@ionicenterprise.com> <46E1AAE7.2010000@cubewerx.com> Message-ID: <46E96BEC.9040904@ionicenterprise.com> I heard back from Carl Reed and he says that it will be available after the Technical Committee meeting on Sept. 20th. sophia Edric Keighan wrote: > Keith, > > FYI ... > > How our proposal fits with OpenLayers recommendations referenced at > the following site: > http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tiling_Client_Recommendation > > Regards, > > Edric > > Sophia Parafina wrote: >> I've asked Carl Reed at OGC to make it available for comment. >> >> sophia >> >> Christopher Schmidt wrote: >>> On Fri, Sep 07, 2007 at 10:47:27AM -0400, Frank Warmerdam wrote: >>> >>>> Folks, >>>> >>>> I was contacted by Edric Keighan about a discussion paper that was >>>> recently submitted to OGC (with Cubewerx as the editor) titled: >>>> >>>> 07-057r2 OpenGIS Tiled WMS Discussion Paper >>>> >>> >>> I'm guessing this would be a continuation of OGC 07-057? The editors of >>> that were not Cubewerx, but from uab.cat, if my records serve. I'd be >>> interested in seeing either of the two documents, and would ask that >>>> I believe it is roughly comparible in goals to this work: >>>> >>>> http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tile_Caching >>>> >>>> I believe Edric is interested in feedback on the paper and support >>>> for the >>>> proposal (for those of us who are OGC members) and perhaps more >>>> importantly >>>> he is interested in implementations of the specification within our >>>> projects >>>> with OpenLayers being the most obvious candidate. >>>> >>> >>> OpenLayers is unlikely to add support for further tiled WMS >>> specifications through the work of its current set of developers. >>> Additional layers would need to be created, tested, and supported by >>> some other person who would accept 'ownership' of the layer type: I've >>> already avoided including some functionality in OpenLayers simply >>> because no one was willing to take on the task of supporting it. >>> If some person or organization is willing to take on the task of >>> supporting a layer, then in general, OpenLayers is open to the task of >>> adding that functionality. However, I'm somewhat hesitant to include >>> yet-another way of accessing pre-cached WMS information: especially if >>> it has not taken into account the design goals of the Recommendation we >>> created at the last FOSS4G, which is described at: >>> >>> http://wiki.osgeo.org/index.php/WMS_Tiling_Client_Recommendation >>> >>> An example of things we explicitly discussed and discarded: * >>> GetTile requests -- we wanted to stick with GetMap, and simply allow >>> for matching the map request to a tile when appropriate. >>> * Using anything other than the standard GetCapabilities for >>> describing functionality: GetCapabilities allows for vendor >>> extensions, and this >>> seemed the right way to pass the information back to the client >>> * Starting the tiles at the '0,0' point of the world (Instead >>> choosing to go for the lower left corner). Note that this is >>> different from >>> Google's tiles, but the same as WorldWind's. * Creating any new >>> form of requests -- it's easiest for client >>> functionality to simply extend the existing requests rather than >>> creating new formats. >>> Again, I don't know what's in the document: if someone could tell me >>> more specifically how to get a copy of it, I could offer a more formal >>> review from the point of view of an implementor of a tile map server. >>> >>> Thanks for the heads up, Frank. >>> Regards, >>> >> >